Can't even finish watching Restrepo

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Alex S. MacDonald on April 20, 2011 at 9:16pm

Very sorry for the tragic loss of a great and courageous journalist.

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Permalink Reply by mouse on April 20, 2011 at 10:09pm

Ellen, I would invite you to read Sebastian's book, "WAR", which came out before the documentary and goes into much greater detail in terms of the men and the mission.

 

After your rant, you backed down by saying, "Don't take it personally Sebastian, perhaps it was the mood I was in."

Seriously?  Not personal??  You cursed at Sebastian, told him he'd sold his soul, and accused him of getting rich off fictionalizing war.  The only way you could have been MORE personally insulting would have been to sock him in the eye or insult his mother.

 

You say this war is "ridiculous", a word which does not, in any context, describe war.  Furthermore, it shows your lack of actual information concerning Afghanistan, the goings-on, and the reasons for our presence there.

 

Of all the poorly thought-out comments you made, I took most offense to the calling of Juan Restrepo a "character".  He was not a character, in the sense you mean.  He was a trained medic, a son, a brother, a friend, a soldier, and an emotional caretaker for his men. I'm certain he feels terrible that he died a painful death before he could provide an acceptable amount of screen time for you.

 

You have been afforded the opportunity to express yourself thoroughly, even as your narrow viewpoint broadens within this very thread, by exposure to a non-partisan truth.  I do hope you are able to appreciate the compassion and generosity with which your attack was received.  (Not by me, I think you're an illiterate asshole, but by Sebastian, who is infinitely more patient.)

 

 

The Internet can really be a great thing.  Among many other benefits it provides, it is an electronic library which we can utilize to educate ourselves on topics about which we are wholly ignorant.  [Nudge nudge, wink wink.] 

 

The Internet is also an opportunity for emotionally-unsatisfied, power-challenged jackasses to loudly defend their lack of intelligence, and project their inferiority-based rage at infinite sources.

 

Perhaps next time you can take a moment to truly consider which would be the more respectable textual legacy.

 

 

Yours in literacy,

Katarina Parker

 

And by the way, no sane person wants war.  We're all anti-war.  That said, oversimplifying it, oppression and genocide cannot be tolerated.  Travel outside your tri-state area and you may just get an inkling of how fortunate you are to be able to do and say and wear and read and watch and create all the things you want to in life, without fear of death. 

_________________________________

_________________________________________

________________________________________________

 

My post from the "Restrepo" Facebook page:

 

Tim was not just a documentary filmmaker. He was a dedicated and adventurous award-winning photojournalist who helped bring The World to the world. Through his bravery and talent, Tim captured the beauty existing within lands in turmoil,  while illuminating the injustices that rarely make it past those borders.

My deepest and sincerest condolences and blessings go out to Tim's family, his dear friends, and all those who knew and loved him. Thank you, Tim, for everything. ♥

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Permalink Reply by Jane on April 20, 2011 at 10:26pm

Ellen, I do think you missed the point but I think had you watched it in it's entirety, you would have come to understand.  Perhaps you were expecting, based on the title of the film, that it was a documentary about a soldier named Restrepo.  It's not.  Per se.  I found it quite poignant how quickly you meet him, and then how quickly he is gone.  That's what these brave, (mostly) very young men, endured.  To understand that, regardless of your personal view of politics and war, is to understand the film.  It's about war, it's about soldiers, it's about camaraderie, danger, bravery, strength of character, and the aftermath of it all.

My sincere condolences to you Mr. Junger.  My favorite photos of Mr. Hetherington are the "sleeping soldiers".  Quite the contrast of innocence and war.

Ellen H said:

Mr. Junger, you are a pro so therefore I understand your patience with me...for some reason I was just so shocked at this movie, expecting more realism because you spent a year embedded with them.  Yes I'm anti-war but not a fanatic, I mean people have to defend themselves now and then but this war is ridiculous imho, so I guess that's the bottom line but I will try to explain more.  I even have to wonder if Netflix edited the movie...but they usually don't do that to the best of my knowledge.

 

For instance, we meet Restrepo right at the beginning, about 30 seconds in the airplane.  Then that's it.   As an audience member, I was not captivated by this character.  I'm sorry.  Perhaps that was not the point of the movie but simply a send off to a larger dynamic, I don't know.

Then we have the third party aspect. Restropo's friends who are so sad about losing him. And I am so sorry this man died. I hate our young people being over there dying for ......nothing.....imho. 

 

The movie continues when the company reaches their post.  Boring times for them, dealing with a different culture, nothing going on, local aggravation, then occasional gunfire, a wayward cow....well.. then we get to the boys one by one telling their snippet in a green room somewhere.  And that's kind of it.

 

Don't take it personally Sebastian, perhaps it was the mood I was in.   I have followed your work over the years which is excellent (I have your book Perfect Storm)  but  Restropo didn't do it for me.

 

I still think NatGeo made you sanitize it but you didn't hear it from me   :)

 

Okay so you're not living large   lol....cool

 

Hugs,  Ellen

 

 

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Permalink Reply by Tim Waters on April 20, 2011 at 11:29pm

I think the bottom line (summed up in some of the other posts) is that this film is an unvarnished look at what Soldiers go through on a daily basis. Sometimes it can be boring as hell, sometimes funny, sometimes sad and sometimes downright crazy. The beauty of this film is that it gives everyone a glimpse into what happens, without politicizing it or forcing opinions on anyone else. I thought it was brilliant and I think we're all better-informed because of it.

 

Thanks for the great work. RIP Tim.

Sebastian Junger said:

Hi Ellen - 

 

Thanks for your honesty. I'm not really sure what to say...there was very little footage of Restrepo because he was killed before we got to spend much time with him. There was fighting...there were civilian casualties from a US airstrike...there were soldiers who were killed. One scene shows a dead American soldier being carried off the battlefield by his sobbing platoon mates. In terms of realism, I'm not sure what more you would ask for in a war film. I mean specifically, what did you think we left out? Why would Nat Geo "sanitize" the film and leave in civilian casualties - including children? I'm really not sure what you mean. If there's a documentary that is more "realistic" than our film I would love to know the title so I could watch it. Arguable The Anderson Platoon is more realistic, but that was from Vietnam and - like our movie - had absolutely no political opinion. But there was a hell of a lot more fighting. But that;s because it was Vietnam...

 

Our film has been pretty roundly applauded - by both the Left and the Right - for its unvarnished realism. Not everyone has liked the film, but even our critics felt it was incredibly realistic. You literally might be the only person I have communicated with who didnt think so. Regardless, it has been nice to hear your thoughts. If you have responses to the questions I asked, above, i'd be interested to hear them.

 

Best,

 

Sebastian

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Permalink Reply by Kathryne Magnuson on April 21, 2011 at 12:25pm

Sebastian,

 

I felt compelled to seek you out this morning in the wake of Mr Hetherington's death. I can only imagine how devastating that loss is to you, both personally and professionally. I've followed your writing for years, and while I've not seen Restrepo (yet), WAR painted the picture you brought to the big screen in film with Mr Hetherington.

 

I didn't expect to find this forum or see this cursing, accusatory rant so soon on the heels of his death, and it made me hurt for you to read it.

 

My condolences on your terrible loss.

 

Kat

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Permalink Reply by Kanani Fong on April 21, 2011 at 11:02pm

Craptastic. Go for it Ellen. Your right to bitch and moan is what every service member through the history of time has fought for.

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Permalink Reply by Ellen H on April 22, 2011 at 12:14am

Hi Mouse,  I was sick to my stomach to hear about the director Mr Hetherington and Chris Hondros being killed in Libya.   What on earth is going on there?  Couldn't believe it.

 

No I did not read War.  I chose to skip it.  Yes probably a big mistake but you know what, I chose to come here and comment anyway.  I just watched the movie.  I have read Vanity Fair for years and have read Perfect Storm which I enjoyed very much....anyways, that's all been said above.  And other things I said I think you might have missed.

 

Well gang up on me as you will.  I don't care. It's an emotional time for everyone under the circumstances and I don't take knee jerk responses personally. I feel bad for Sebastian.  He must be horrified and so saddened,  That is one of of the most important spiritual and human lessons I've ever learned. Not to take things personally (see The Four Agreements).   We dish it out and we have to take it too.   I understand.

 

Fair enough Mouse....though I don't consider myself completely illiterate....lol

 

mouse said:

Ellen, I would invite you to read Sebastian's book, "WAR", which came out before the documentary and goes into much greater detail in terms of the men and the mission.

 

After your rant, you backed down by saying, "Don't take it personally Sebastian, perhaps it was the mood I was in."

Seriously?  Not personal??  You cursed at Sebastian, told him he'd sold his soul, and accused him of getting rich off fictionalizing war.  The only way you could have been MORE personally insulting would have been to sock him in the eye or insult his mother.

 

You say this war is "ridiculous", a word which does not, in any context, describe war.  Furthermore, it shows your lack of actual information concerning Afghanistan, the goings-on, and the reasons for our presence there.

 

Of all the poorly thought-out comments you made, I took most offense to the calling of Juan Restrepo a "character".  He was not a character, in the sense you mean.  He was a trained medic, a son, a brother, a friend, a soldier, and an emotional caretaker for his men. I'm certain he feels terrible that he died a painful death before he could provide an acceptable amount of screen time for you.

 

You have been afforded the opportunity to express yourself thoroughly, even as your narrow viewpoint broadens within this very thread, by exposure to a non-partisan truth.  I do hope you are able to appreciate the compassion and generosity with which your attack was received.  (Not by me, I think you're an illiterate asshole, but by Sebastian, who is infinitely more patient.)

 

 

The Internet can really be a great thing.  Among many other benefits it provides, it is an electronic library which we can utilize to educate ourselves on topics about which we are wholly ignorant.  [Nudge nudge, wink wink.] 

 

The Internet is also an opportunity for emotionally-unsatisfied, power-challenged jackasses to loudly defend their lack of intelligence, and project their inferiority-based rage at infinite sources.

 

Perhaps next time you can take a moment to truly consider which would be the more respectable textual legacy.

 

 

Yours in literacy,

Katarina Parker

 

And by the way, no sane person wants war.  We're all anti-war.  That said, oversimplifying it, oppression and genocide cannot be tolerated.  Travel outside your tri-state area and you may just get an inkling of how fortunate you are to be able to do and say and wear and read and watch and create all the things you want to in life, without fear of death. 

_________________________________

_________________________________________

________________________________________________

 

My post from the "Restrepo" Facebook page:

 

Tim was not just a documentary filmmaker. He was a dedicated and adventurous award-winning photojournalist who helped bring The World to the world. Through his bravery and talent, Tim captured the beauty existing within lands in turmoil,  while illuminating the injustices that rarely make it past those borders.

My deepest and sincerest condolences and blessings go out to Tim's family, his dear friends, and all those who knew and loved him. Thank you, Tim, for everything. ♥

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Permalink Reply by Jane on April 22, 2011 at 12:23am

Mouse, well said.  Thank you.

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Permalink Reply by mouse on April 22, 2011 at 2:38am

Ellen,

 

Honestly, how I responded to you didn't have anything to do with Tim's death, about which, yes, I am very upset.  I always welcome intelligent debate and I appreciate the value of opposing points of view, as long as they are well-researched and based in an acceptably shared reality.  I'm giddy that you loved "A Perfect Storm".  (Sebastian has authored other books, by the way.)  What galls me is that you came to Sebastian's internet home, as it were, worked up, anti-war guns blazing - pardon the pun - throwing around insults and accusations and calling into question his very character in terms of his monetary compensation.  Behaving this way, you ask me to believe that you didn't expect a shit-storm?

 

As I said, intelligent debate is absolutely welcomed.  But you damn well better take your dunce cap off before you come into any forum throwing around unfounded partisan sound-bytes.  You would have done well to have read "WAR".  In my opinion, it is the foundation of the trilogy that includes "Restrepo" and Tim's photography book, "Infidel".  I will say that I think your misunderstanding of the film stems from the fact that you went in expecting something completely different, and so ended up feeling cheated somehow because it didn't fulfill that expectation.  In my view, "Restrepo" is more a collection of emotional experiences than anything else.  It mainly documents the feelings these men in this particular platoon have about this localized area of this specific country.  There's very little that is broad about it, and it makes no broad claims whatsoever.  In fact, I believe its genius lies in its neutrality. 

 

So, what I wrote to you you can absolutely take personally.  I meant it as such.  It was not "knee-jerk".  I didn't misunderstand you, and I wasn't speaking from a place of grief. 

 

Now that you've become calmer, I suggest you go back and read your initial post.  I imagine - I hope - it will seem shocking to you.  I hope you clearly see now that your words, your tone, and your lack of actual discussable points didn't speak to any real desire to debate; they just made you seem like a troll.

 

I appreciate your response to me, repetitive and passive-aggressive as it was.  My favorite part was the spiritual stuff at the end.  I actually laughed a little.

 

 

KP/mouse

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Permalink Reply by Frank Driscoll on April 22, 2011 at 12:51pm

I guess it's ' in the eye of the beholder.' After watching Restrepo I can't imagine that one can see anything but the futility of this war and the pain and unending sorrow our government forces on Afghan civilians and the American youth we allow our government to send there. The haunting images of the casualties, Afghan children and young men like SSgt Rougle, illustrate the devastation of our never ending wars.   

 

Now that network news is controlled by the same investors who profit from these wars, I am grateful for this revealing commentary on the state of our national policy, and the willingness of Junger and Hetherington to risk their lives in its production.

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Permalink Reply by mouse on April 22, 2011 at 5:27pm

@Frank, then Restrepo did its job.  It got you to think. 

 

I will say a couple of things though.  Like it or not, you, as a taxpayer, are one of those investors you mentioned.  (And I'll say here that my personal politics are of the left, but I evaluate on a case-by-case basis.  Sebastian has said he is an "anti-war liberal".  Does knowing that expand your view at all about what you think this unbiased film is trying to say?) 

 

It is far too easy to blame the big, bad THEY's of the world.  One of the real horrors of life sets in when you realize you're part of the They, perhaps very much against your wishes.

 

This line of yours is confusing:

 

"I am grateful for this revealing commentary on the state of our national policy..."

 

Since no one on this thread has discussed politics, I'm assuming you're talking about the film?  And if that is the case, I would ask you which film it was you saw again?  Restrepo is a lot of things.  A "commentary on the state of our national policy" is most certainly not one of them.

 

KP/mouse

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Permalink Reply by Frank Driscoll on April 22, 2011 at 6:33pm

Hi Mouse.. thanks for your thoughts. It's in line three of my note that I take responsibility where I say, "the American youth WE allow our government to send there." My point is that for many reasons, we who object to this war are not as committed to its end as we were say, to stopping the Vietnam debacle.

I must correct you when you declare that taxpayers are investors. An investor is one who seeks a return on the capital put into a venture. We tax payers have spent a trillion dollars on Iraq/Afghanistan and will not realize a dime's return. Now, Dick Cheney, though his holdings in Haliburton has realized a substantial return. The CEO's of every major defense company are benefitting from extraordinary  gains and the oil companies are enjoying the most profitable period of their existance.

Please allow me to disagree with you again, Mouse, and without the sarcasm that unfortunately detracts from your overall thoughtfulness. In my opinion, the movie Restrepo is a commentary. When taken as a whole, it is a visible and oral statement on the efficacy of the ten year effort by the United states of America to gain control of Afghanistan.

Just look at the scorecard. Like every nation who has preceded us, we have failed to gain control; we are making enemies of the people and motivating many to become new recruits for the Taliban; we have sent waves of dedicated, patriotic youth into a situation they know by the time they leave to be a futile mission, and if they return to the States in one piece, they can't find a job; and the majority of Americans in most every poll want us out. 

So there is a big bad 'they' who are behind this war effort and it will continue far into the future, for as long as it provides a profit to industry, paid for by our tax dollars, or until Americans take to the streets to shut it down. In my opinion you missed the point of the movie which describes in the clearest, most basic format how bankrupt our national policy is in East Asia. At least that's how I see it.

 

Frank

 

 

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